How to Heal After Divorce: Grief, Identity Loss & Emotional Recovery

Hello, hello there fearfully and wonderfully made human and welcome back to the holistic counselor podcast. I'm your host Diana Rice, licensed mental health counselor, founder of Through the Valley Therapy and Transformed Mind Consulting and Coaching. And this is where I hope we explore the intersection of theology, biology, and psychology with curiosity, humility, and grace.

Today, we are talking about a topic that touches so many lives. Yet, it is often carried in silence. divorce recovery, emotional healing after divorce, grief, identity loss, self-worth, and learning how to rebuild your life when the story you thought or you were living suddenly changes.

Whether you are currently going through a separation, navigating divorce, healing from a past divorce, supporting a friend or a loved one, or trying to understand the emotional impact of relationship loss. I believe this conversation is going to offer compassion, clarity, and practical tools for the healing journey.

I first learned about today's guest through an invitation to an online event where she was presenting on divorce recovery. I was not able to attend but the topic caught my attention because as a therapist I have sat with so many people who are not just grieving the end of a marriage.

They are grieving the future they imagined the version of themselves they lost the stability they were trying to hold on to and sometimes even the shame or judgment that could come from family culture or faith communities. When I learned more about Shirley, oh, you're gonna have to barely.

Is that how you say it? Yay. And her work, I was drawn to her holistic, compassionate, and structured approach to helping people process grief, rebuild confidence, restore emotional stability, strengthen self-worth, develop healthy coping skills, and reclaim their lives after divorce. Shirley Berthalamy is a licensed mental health counselor, licensed professional counselor, certified addiction professional, certified life coach, and founder and CEO of Holistic Lady Counseling Services.

She has more than 10 years of experience serving individuals, couples, and families within the mental health and substance use field. She specializes in divorce recovery coaching and supports clients who are navigating separation, divorce, and the lasting emotional impact of divorce of past divorces.

Through her her divorce recovery coaching program, Shirley helps clients move from surviving to healing, from heartbreak to hope, and from emotional overwhelm to personal reinvention. So whether you are asking, "How do I heal after divorce? Why do I feel stuck? How do I rebuild my confidence?

Or will I ever feel like myself again? This conversation is for you, Shirley. Welcome to the Holistic Counselor Podcast. I'm glad you're here.

Thank you so much for having me.

You're welcome. So, um before we divi dive into uh divorce recovery, I want to start with your story. What experiences in your own life or career made you so passionate about helping women heal after separation, heartbreak, and identity loss?

Okay. So, um Okay. And and this is why I wanted to, you know, have my coaching program because as a licensed therapist, we were always told that there's only so much that we can share and so much, you know, and I do understand that part, but I felt so disconnected from, you know, the people that I was serving if they didn't really know, you know, at least a little bit about my my story cuz I'm all about authenticity.

So um for myself um I was married for 12 and a half years um and unfortunately it ended in divorce um and I know how I felt during that time you know feeling hurt feeling misunderstood um experiencing depression anxiety you know all sorts of feelings that I couldn't at the time put into words um and in and the the support that I received um I did receive support but it was like I felt like [clears throat] my story um it was just it was not just for myself.

What I went through wasn't just for myself. I felt like you know God allowed it to happen so that I can serve other people. Um and you know so with I remember during um my divorce feeling you know feeling worthless feeling um a sense of like I felt like a failure.

I felt like, you know, and because it g it got to the point where it I felt like that's um it defined my identity

where I I tried to find myself after getting out of it. And it was it it took a long time because I had a lot of anger. I went through all of the stages of grief. I had a lot of anger and I think anger me being angry for so long, it kept me from moving forward.

It kept me, you know, from really, you know, seeing things from a different perspective.

It just I just um and I felt like I want for to help others, you know, navigate this process and not feel stuck like I was for so long, you know, and and yeah, luckily, you know, by the grace of God and, you know, and having the the the support and really taking time to process what I went through and taking some accountability as well, you know, and it just I it was a lot of soulsearching,

you know, and um you know so I didn't and and the thing is my goal was um to help others so they don't make impulsive decisions

while they're going through um this distressful time in their in their lives cuz it it can happen you know making quick decisions you know without thinking you know being led by their emotions and because a lot of the um [snorts] the things that I went through could have been avoided had I just really ten a step back and also been honest about what I was going through because I did a lot of, you know, you know,

hiding, you know, not really sharing, you know, what I was experiencing and it um it really delayed my healing process

and uh and I felt like I had to um especially coming from the um Christian background, which it should be the opposite way of looking at it. It should be cuz the church is supposed to be a hospital, you know, where you're supposed to go when you're not feeling well, when you go when you're going through a tough time.

But I felt like the church was mostly or Christian people so-called was who I was hiding from.

Like I really didn't want people to know what I was going through because I didn't want to feel judged.

Oh,

you know.

Now, now we're going from therapist to preacher. No. Well, what I'm hear what I'm hearing, Shirley, is that instead of you becoming bitter, you became better.

Because I I walk through with I've never been divorced. I married a man who has been divorced and he's a Southern Baptist preachers kid. And I'm not putting any denomination down because there's judgmental human beings in every faith,

right?

Okay. We have high controlling religion in every faith

we have. Okay. So I think what happened is that you started to understand how to respond in wisdom instead of reacting in emotion because

yes

what you're talking about like I said like I've I've studied it. I've not experienced it, but I did come really really close to I mean I had called a divorce lawyer at one point and I had to go to a lot of counseling, right?

But the thing is these are things that happen where the person that's going through it is hoping for that. Those are the other things that they have to grieve and not only the judgment because I I remember when he told me, you know, later on cuz I came later after his whole situation with his first wife.

It was just like the the condemn condemnation. God hates divorce, right? And so yeah,

or like you have to especially for a woman because it's really different where I've heard from numerous women that uh you got to suck it up, buttercup. like this is this is no matter what God hates divorce and and then you're trying you're trying because you have your faith.

Did you grow up in the church?

Yes, I grew up in the church you know um and from you know parents that have been married for I'd say what 53 years 54 years and [clears throat] that doesn't mean that their relationship was perfect. they've had their struggles,

you know, but at the same time, it's just like you stay in it. That's it. Like you're married, you make the decision, you know, to get married, you take those vows, you stay in it, you know, and I I get that part, but there are some situations and even a Bible, you know, allows for, you know, divorce, you know, if there's infidelity.

And of course, I mean, common sense, if there's abuse, yeah, you do not stay in a, you know, a marriage.

Oh, no. girl. But I saw people at churches, leaders at churches, and I would be like, "No, this woman's being abused."

Yeah.

And they're like, "Oh, no. He's the head of the household." So, this is when I started because I I became a Christian when I was 29. But then you don't know like you go in and you're trying to find community because that's the thing.

And so, the community is teaching you certain things,

right? Right.

How did how did you disentangle these things? Because that's something I really want to people to understand because you still love Jesus, correct?

Absolutely. Absolutely. So, I I felt so condemned, you know, because I went back and forth trying to figure out like what do I do, you know, I can't stay in this anymore, but yet there's this God hates divorce and like where do I go from here, you know?

Um, and it it was just it was me going back and forth and I just felt and and that what really brought me to a place of depression because I was just like, "Okay, this is not working. I've tried, you know, tried to make it work.

I've, you know, um I even ex, you know, didn't file for divorce or anything for it was years later because I was like, "Okay, I got to figure this out cuz I can't get divorced, you know, you know, but it was like at the same time like by it was just I just knew that I knew that it was not working.

I knew that I wanted a better life for myself and for my daughter. So, I had to to figure it out." And then and then I I remember her asking people, you know, um so what if I were to like one day get remarried?

Would you remarry me?

like I don't cuz I felt so condemned like like what do you where do you you know because of how I it was it was presented you know and and as I you know have my and this is why it's so important to have your own relationship with God like a real relationship because as I begin to talk to God and spend time with him and as he begin to heal my heart and I'm just like okay I know that there's nothing that separates us

from the love of Christ and the Bible says that. So if I get divorced by and and it's it's saying that okay because of infidelity or whatever and I do decide I'm like God is a forgiving God you know it's not that I didn't want it to work it just it just didn't work you know um so I'm I'm sure he doesn't want for me to just live my life like and just be miserable or whatever.

Now, there's some people where they don't get remarried, and that's fine, you know, and God is a, you know, keeps them and and that's and that's perfectly um fine. Um but if that's something that is a desire that I have, you know, and I'm like, you know, God, I I serve you and you know, and I want you to lead my life and and I believe that he he is a God of love and forgiveness and restoration, you know.

So, um, yeah. So, once I begin to recognize that and I'm like, you know what? Um, no, I I'm going to move forward. I'm going to move forward. And it did feel so heavy, but it took years for me to get there.

You know, it took years for me to get there. Um, and and I and that's another reason why I have my program because I don't want other women to feel like they don't have a safe space for them to feel like they're judged.

For them to feel like, no, I want them to know that, you know, God loves you no matter what, you know, and it's okay for you to come with him, come to him honestly, cuz he already knows your heart. He already knows your situation, you know.

So, and and and that's my that has been my goal.

Yeah. Well, it sounds like you went from inherited faith to examined faith. And this is something that I do a lot with my clients is disentangle what is actually biblical and what is actually a narrative that was taught by the denomination. I mean, think about how many if if I put the number out there, people start like, "Oh my goodness."

But there is thousands upon thousands of Christian denominations. So how do you you know what I mean?

So it's it's about what you just said is like you you started actually probably opening up the word and really diving deep in and going wait where is this coming from and how do I because that is who Jesus is is he is the way the truth the life he is the freedom you know in and this is with anything because grief is is grief is part of life like what you experience with grief I know grief in another way like death death grief Okay.

But I've also had to grieve jobs.

And to me with the marriage, like you're able now to help your clients because you have vocabulary. Because that's what's missing when you have all that emotion going in and you're bubbling over and you're reacting in emotion. It's because you don't first of all probably have the community and you don't have the vocabulary.

Yeah.

And that the freedom to just have the emotional wheel because we're not taught that in churches. We don't teach that or schools.

Yeah, absolutely.

Especially in our culture, right? In the black and brown culture, it's like suck it up, buttercup. Like, this is part of life. This is how it is. If you're going to cry, I'm going to give you something to cry about. Um, and then some people like to use the word in order to control the humans.

And that is dangerous to me. And so I that's why I think, you know, you might hear a little bit of like because I have seen women in in those walls of churches being told certain things. And I think this is where I'm grateful for my story surely because I was raised by a bunch of single women and I didn't come to the Lord until 29.

I mean, I was raised Catholic and another [clears throat] and Sanoria, you know, I had that a little dabble of that with my Puerto Rican side of the family, but it was just I always was search I was always angry at God. I was angry at everybody honestly, but it's it's the grief and I had no like, you know, I was there was a time where my mom was trying to make it work with my dad and but it never did.

He wasn't he was unhealed. This is what I'm realizing.

You get a bunch of unhealed humans and then some of them get married together because honestly what I saw in some churches is that they were um I hate to say it because you know the purity culture and how it's like you got to you wait for yourself to marriage which I I agree that's a healthy thing but you [clears throat] don't you don't teach people what if like the guy you know like is abuse or anything else like there's no other

taught process of like yeah

you know what I mean? Yeah.

So, [clears throat] they get married at 18 years old with with unhealed situations or no no vocabulary and then you're married and then this is, you know, I like you said, you saw your parents, but their story is their story. My my in-laws were married 60some years.

Their story is their story. Things have changed and evolved and we have vocabulary. So, I really want to know, you know, you you mentioned that depression happened and you had some there's hidden mental health effects of divorce that people don't talk about enough.

Can you, you know, especially for women, you know, like want to

talk about that?

Okay. Yeah. So another thing other than depression and anxiety I I think especially um for women who are who don't feel like they can open up and talk about this subject and they're going through so much in the in in the marriage.

Um, so yes, that's the the depression, anxiety, but also I noticed that um they often um have like an anxious attachment like where yeah, where they're um like overfunctioning in a marriage, trying to hide things, trying to fix things, trying to make things look like what it is, like uh like appear a certain way for the public

so people won't really know what's going on. So they're always on edge. always trying to, you know, and it's not the reality, you know, it's not the reality. And then they take on these people, people pleasing tendency, which they may have already had before they entered, you know, um the relationship.

So, and then so they take a lot of things in the relationship that they probably shouldn't have. And because they've invested so long, it's like they lose themselves in the relationship. And by the time they realize that, you know, it it, you know, then it's too late and um they've given so much and that's where the anger, the resentment comes in, you know, um because they didn't really have an identity inside, you know, the marriage.

It was so much so of like trying to make it work, make something that instead of actually healing and actually maybe like going to therapy or, you know, going to couples counseling or maybe going to individual therapy, you know, while they were in the marriage.

And so when it the relationship falls apart, it's just like, who am I after this? Because I've given so much of myself that I don't even know who I am anymore,

right?

You know?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and then the stigma of just the word counseling,

right? Or like I I should have it all together because I'm a believer in Jesus, right? And so I should have more faith and I should pray more. I'm not praying enough. I'm not doing this enough. And and that that mentality though is is like, wait, what?

Like how how do you how do you deal with your clients with that? Because that's something I see a lot too. It's just like, wait, where'd you get that where'd you get that story from? Where'd you get that information from that you're not doing things enough?

Right? Like because to me shame and guilt is from the world and other humans putting their you know

conviction is from the Lord

right

and the only way you could can get convicted is you if you're sitting still alone in his word in prayer

and and and when all that stuff starts boiling up like and becoming accountable because you said a word you you said that earlier like you realize like

you went beyond the pain and the feelings and then you started understanding okay what am I responsible for

y

girl. Tell me about your her your a her divorce recovery coaching program then because I know you get it and I know that you you know if this is your niche I really would love people to work with you because I had this conversation with you before we even pressed record.

Yes. And I just realized like, no, you understand and you love the Lord and it's not,

you know, people are going to be like, oh, you're just making it easy for people to get divorced or it's just like if they have an emotion and and it's just like, all right, here's our excuse. But how do how do you disentangle like that stuff from actually like,

okay, you're ready for my program,

right? you said I like how you said it where people probably think, "Oh, she's making easy for because it's it's not what it is." Because the thing is, um, and I also tell people like even if you're separated and you want to join my my program because not every separation ends in divorce.

That's right. So that's and and I want I want to make it very clear for people to understand because um if you're able to actually and you use the word stillness be still you know then you're less reactive you know you're able to sit with yourself you're able to you know take yeah take accountability and say okay this is what yes this is probably what my um partner did or whatever you know but how what am I doing like how did I contribute to it?

Because at the end of the day, whether you stay in a relationship or not, you still have to work on you.

Yes.

You know, you still have to work on you. So, it may not be that you probably weren't the one that stepped out and was unfaithful, but you probably lacked boundaries.

You know, you know, you probably had a, you know, didn't have a healthy attachment style. you probably was um you know uh were were someone who uh had a hard time regulating their emotions you know all of these things so it's it's important to you know to still to um so I do not I'm not about promoting anyone you know getting divorced this is why I do divorce recovery someone who is recovering you know from divorce

and so that they don't lose themselves or feel like you know it's the end uh you know it's it's completely the end from here like there's a life you know after this um so yeah so it's about you know um really you know taking taking some time processing going through the grief um the grief uh stages which some people may not know um which is basically like any um the stages that anyone goes through after a

loss.

So it is the initial like denial then anger depression you know bargaining and also uh and the last one is acceptance. So we go through these stages and then also we talk about other things where it is really we talk about spirituality, we talk about um you know really you know connecting um with God to help you through this process and we talk about you know um as well like co-parenting.

We talk about different things throughout the program. So in my coaching program it is it's basically it's a it's an entire framework where it is it's called heal grow and thrive. So it's a 24-week coaching program

each yeah each each um stage like the uh each stage is eight weeks.

Okay.

So yeah so and they can take it in three different ways. It can be either self-paced. It can either be um one-on-one with me or in um within a group.

Wow.

Yeah. It's all the same curriculum, but it it can be taken in different ways. And the community itself is is is open, you know, um you know, that they can receive ongoing support, you know. So, if they don't feel like they're ready to join any of those three um programs, then they could just, you know, uh be a part of the community so they don't feel like they're alone until they're ready to take the next step.

Okay. So, so the beauty of you being a licensed professional, I get to ask what modalities did you because you know some people right now are in a different country

and they and they probably still can do your course though, right? They could probably buy it on the Okay. But I'm just saying [clears throat] like

or they can't afford it or they just don't know. And like to me it's like

what modalities helped you because I know like I don't I haven't I've experienced grief. So and I know the modalities that have helped me heal in processing a lot of CPTTSD as a child and stuff like that. And just because I'm still married doesn't mean I, you know, I had to do my own work, take responsibility for myself when things got unhealthy because, you know, like I said earlier, like two two human beings sometimes that did not do their own work because there are healthy marriages.

And Shirley and I are not people that are bashing marriage. I just want to make things crystal clear right now. We're not bashing marriage. We're not going if you're, you know, if if you're hurting all, you know, like go get divorce. It is just really taking the steps of understanding, not blaming, not shaming, not ignoring, but to actually be still

and know that he's he's God.

And there's human beings that have gone through stuff.

And it's like wounded healers, right? Like you go got to the other side and survived the valley.

Yes. And so what modalities really helped you like when you think back of like what were the things that got you through like that really helped you in our field you know because the easy thing is like well God of course he's the bigger picture that that probably gave you the modality and gave you the tool but I want people to understand right now like because some people are in you know freeze fawn

and they don't know where which way to go.

Right. Right. Um I would say um cognitive behavioral. Yeah. CBT. Um because for me it it was I know for for myself there was a lot of um like it was like a mental beatdown for me like me blaming myself. So I believe a lot starts with our thoughts.

Yes.

Cuz our thoughts impact the way that we feel and impact the way that we react to things. So I wanted to go from a place of, you know, not reacting but responding.

Yeah.

And [clears throat] I realized that, you know, a lot of and and that's how where the enemy attacks us in our minds, too. That's where the battlefield is is.

So I had to as I spent time with God, the way my thinking changed,

you know, that the way that I thought about myself because like I said, I felt like a failure. you know, I felt like, you know, um I was like, "Okay, I'm just another, you know, statistic.

I'm just another," you know, and um and so I had to change the way that I was thinking by renewing my mind with what he says about me, you know, and so I had to search his word and say, "Okay, what does God say about me, you know, and then start to meditate on that

and then I be and it is not a one-time thing. No,

it is really you have to really sit with the word of God and and and really, you know, um not only help him to ask him to help you understand it and how you can apply it to your life. And as I begin to do that, I'm like, okay, if he says this about me and he thinks this about me, why do I think this about myself?

So, where is this coming from?

Where are these thoughts? you know, and I started to realize it's either it's coming from my past of maybe what someone said. And it could be what maybe, you know, ex said or and I'm just speaking in general for anybody. It could be something your ex said, something your parents said, something you know, but where was that seed planted in your mind for you start to start to think that this is who you are, you know, because when I open the word of God,

my father in heaven says differently,

you know, so who do I choose to believe?

Yeah. You know, so I once that transformation started, I was like, okay, I choose to believe what my father in heaven says about me. And then and yeah, and then over time and and it is it is a journey.

It truly is a journey. So even if I have this program as a um

a 24-week program,

I have the community available because I know that it is a journey.

Yeah. It's not just like and they can do it at their own and and this is why I have the self-paced as well. You can do it at your pace. You can do it because I understand that there are moments where you may still have questions.

You may you still need that support. You know you and it becomes like you know it and it becomes a safe space. And my my uh my goal is to for others within the community to begin to impact other people. So it it just spreads, you know, like the impact just keeps spreading.

Um because so many people are hurting.

Yes.

And they don't have tools and accountability accountability is really important. I mean, think about aa, you know, and and you had that safe community where you go in and you know that other people are going through that kind of uh, you know, how I say it is like you're on the same road with different scenery,

you know, on the same trail maybe, but different trees or something like that. And and so that's what I hear. I hear the cognitive behavioral therapy, which I love because this that's how I start with a lot of my clients. Do you know what a cognitive distortion is?

I need you to start catching yourself, but not only catching because I don't want to have you continue like, oh, I do this, I do this. I also need you to see the glimmers instead of the triggers,

right? And so to me, what you're talking about is neuroplasticity as well, the science behind this is why we're both holistic counselors

because we start understanding the mind, the body, and spirit because yes, the spiritual aspect, the Lord has given his beautiful word and we meditate on it because guess what? Wherever your brain goes, your energy flows. And so if you're sitting there in the negative thought processes all the time thinking, you know, that critical, this is where I'm in the IFS, um, rabbit hole.

So CBT and IFS because I'm also, like you said, um, you know, you start thinking like that inner critic's coming in and you're like, when's the first time you heard that?

Oh, I heard it when I was six. I saw my dad do that to my mom and that's how I believed women should be treated and so then we go there and then I'm like all right we're going to love on that little girl now.

Right. Right.

And then

it's so true.

Right. And the renewing of the mind like that to me that's you know that's do not conform to the patterns of this world but be transformed by the renewing of the mind. And you could do that beautifully with God's word. So when you work with um groups like do you have a Facebook group or how's that work or can anyone can start because you said it was 24 weeks

each part is eight weeks. So can anybody start with you at any time like or is it like oh I'm now having an opening for the first eight weeks anybody want to come? How's that work? Mhm.

So yeah, so within my groups cuz I want it to be effective. So yeah, so I do have a time frame. So I don't want it to be so I usually the the maximum I would say between I was 8 to 10. I don't want it larger than that because I want for people to really get the most out of the groups, you know.

I want to give them time to talk. I want to, you know, give them time to really cuz I I give like I give assignments. I give homework. I because I love to give homework.

Me too.

Because I I want you to work on things,

you know, while you're outside of the sessions.

Well, that's the renewing of the mind. Like that's the neuroplasticity. That's the new neurons attaching itself. That's the learning. That's the growing. Yeah, I get it, girl.

Right. Right. So, um and I do announce when the the the next time is go is going to be, you know. So yeah, because I wanted I wanted it to just keep going in rotation, you know. So um but yeah, so and I want them to get the the the most out of the groups.

Now, if they can't make it, like I said, the community can drop a question

in the community and it's not just me. It can be anyone who can, you know, um if you know, based on where they're at, cuz everybody's in in a different stage, you know, and they can chime in and say, "Okay, you know, I get this.

I understand this. I I resonate with this. Yeah. So, it it's not like they're just waiting. Um and and like I said, there's other options as well other um that I have um in for the program.

Oh, okay. Good. So, I want to talk about some red flags that someone may still be carrying unresolved divorce trauma or emotional wounds into new relationships without realizing it. Because that's something that

I see too and within my own

community, my own personal community of people that have gotten divorced and then they go into another relationship with the baggage, you know, and they haven't dealt with

the situation. So, what are some red flags that you see as a therapist? cuz I I could talk all day about the red flags and the and the good stuff that happens too when the person actually does the work. That's I have to make it crystal clear because a lot of people especially in our culture want that magic bullet that quick and easy that I they're feeling so much pain like I get it like when you're feeling so much pain you just want it to end.

Right. Right.

Okay. That's how depression comes in because you're just in you're you know and so to me that you know I have to get people to understand there's hope out there and there's tiny steps you can take right

I mean the first thing it would be especially in our culture is to swallow your pride because that pride that pride wall is like sometimes the person their whole body is falling apart they got ulcers backachche they're breaking now, you know, but they're I'm fine.

I'm fine. I'm fine. And this wall of like, you know, they think it's the wall of strength and you're like, whoa,

what's going on? Right. So, just tell me what Well, I just named a few red flags, but go ahead.

Yeah. No, that's fine. That's fine. No, the thing is before I even go into the red flag, when you talk about pride, like, oh my goodness. Um, I've noticed even be uh when even with working with couples, I do work with couples sometimes.

One of your main the main issues that I see with their bumpy heads is pride.

Yeah.

You know. Okay. So, I'm Yeah. So, in terms of like, you know, Yes. the red flags. Yeah.

Pride is definitely one. being easily triggered when a person when in terms of them not really being and in and saying this um in terms of them not um being ready like if they're just to um in in terms of the the question that you ask you said um yes so if they're easily triggered I would say that is one if they're constantly bringing up like their ex that's another one um yeah so and also if

they are um yeah so I I would say those two and also comparing um comparing their their their ex to like um other people like like if it let's just say if they meet somebody they're comparing their the their ex to the other person.

So and also just self-sabotaging behaviors as well is also a red flag that I would say.

Yeah. and and either good or bad because I've heard it like it's it's like oh my because then that's the thing and it's hard because if you're in this love and the oxytocin has connected you so well and you thought this would be it for the rest of your life and you know that's another grief part but to me it's it's not only compared because I've heard it where they're just downgrading the ex like so terribly

like so bad because they're in pain like you know hurt people hurt people, but I also have heard like, "Oh, he used to do this for me."

Like the good stuff while they're with somebody else. And I'm just like, you're talking about your ex because they still are hoping that this new person would do these things. It's it's

right.

So, yeah. To me, like, you're right on with that. and and the activation in the body because you know the word trigger is so overused in our c in our tik tok mental health culture that it's it's just recognizing

when your body's activated

right so what so being holistic I want to understand because you understand the psychology part like CBT what is does your training also implement the body in any way

okay So, in terms of Okay. So, I do a lot of like check-in like uh emotional check-ins

where it's just, you know, making sure that you like making sure that you're okay, you know, selfcare. So when I talk about the body um is making sure that you you stay hydrated, making sure that you're eating a balanced meal um you know making sure that um that you are you know um very aware like more self-aware of how you're feeling in the moment and not just um just bypassing whatever you're experiencing but actually doing something about it.

If you need to slow down, slow down, you know. Um, you know, if you need to take a break, take a break, you know, but just being more aware of how your body is functioning and listening to your body as well is very important.

Yeah.

Um, you know, because no, I I truly believe that, you know, our even if we might say that we're okay, our body is really, you know, taking is is really taking account

of how we're really doing, you know. So, you may say that you're okay, but your body feels differently. Um, so I would say really

um listening to your body and how how you're feeling, how you're responding to things. Um, yeah.

And just and also you know just creating time you know um just for you you know what whatever that might be you know it could be uh a morning routine a night routine um you know just practicing some form of self-care where it doesn't involve anybody else because a lot of um the people who are um experiencing divorce is you know they have kids so it's is so they go from you know uh just this life

of being married and and um not not you know not being in that role anymore but yet they're still in the parental role you know so it's like okay when I get off work you know um you I'm in that role and then when I come home I'm the parent so when do I have time for myself right

so it's just creating routine so that they can have you know time for themselves so they can take care of those theirelves

um because if if you're not taking care of yourself you know you're really not any good to anyone,

right?

Yeah. So,

and your body will signal. Yeah. Because sometimes, you know, instead of like people, I have these symptoms. I'm like, no, those are signals.

They're signaling out. Your body is signaling at you and you need to listen. It's like the check engine right in a car. Like, even though we're not cars, but it's just like the light comes on and you ignore it and you ignore it or gas and then you run out of gas.

Like,

so to me, it's like it is so important to to that stillness. Again, I love that you have a morning routine and an evening. Like I no matter what, like there's single moms with a lot of kids and they're really

their whole body's on fire, right? It's just like

they're and they just having to push through. Which you got to thank that part of you, that manager part, that the brain saying, "Hey, listen, like you have to push through." which is fine, but at the same time like you

you're gonna burn the candle at both ends and you're end up and and that's the thing with the pride like I work with non-Christians as well and so I try to make them understand it's ego and humility, right? The flesh and the spirit.

Yeah.

And so it's like

so true.

It's trying to disentangle which surely like I think that's what I heard is like you you came in when you were going through it you were in a lot of pain and a lot your whole mind and body was signaling out and you went through with the changing of the mind with CBT and now you understand the importance of the being still and taking care of your body no matter what honestly you know because I hear it too it's like well you know I'm a single mom I can't.

I have to work the two jobs. And I get it. Like I come from that. I come.

But I also know how it hurt me because my mom did not stop and do the healing,

you know, and I'm not trying to guilt or shame anyone listening that's going through this stuff, you know, but I want you to understand you're not alone. So if a woman's saying absolutely,

will I ever feel myself again? Because when you're in it, you don't think that there is any hope that you know in your experience, what does genuine healing and personal reinvention after divorce actually look like.

Okay. Yeah. So, it it does get better, you know. It does get better. And and the reason why I And it takes it's a journey. It takes it's one day at a time.

Yeah.

One conversation at a time, one prayer at a time. one and and the thing is um cuz you're already overwhelmed when you are going through this process. So your healing has to be somewhere it has to be at a where you feel at peace, you know, where you're just like it's not another thing that you're adding on your big to-do list, you know.

So and you know so one of the one of the things that I tell the women as well as you're you know going through this process create a to-do list like every day have your to-do list make it from like the most important thing to the least important thing that you have to you know what's most of a priority to the least and work from there.

Now, just, you know, and keep in mind that you don't have to get everything done on that list.

And being that you started from the highest priority, that means that let's just say it's five things and you got two or three done, that means you got the most important done.

Yeah.

You know, throughout your day and celebrate your win, you know. So when it comes to um reinvention, I would say based on my experience,

you know, the reinvention again is, you know, my reinvention came through Christ. That's just what it is. you know, I can't really go around, you know, around that because it's like that's that it I was able to, you know, you know, walk like differently in terms of like how I respond to things, how I think about things, and it just helped me all around.

So, um, I was able to, you know, not rush my my healing because when you're going through it, you don't you you don't you want to get out of it as soon as possible. You don't

cuz it hurts.

Yeah. Yeah. Cuz it hurts, you know. But when you start to realize that,

you know, it's it's there's a development that's happening in the process.

There's growth that's happening in the process. You're not just it's not just happening to you, you know. You know, there's something that God is doing in your life that is going to make you a better better version of yourself when you come out of this

if you surrender.

If you surrender

because that's that's the thing cuz sometimes it's fear, you know, it's the false evidence appearing real. You're scared to move forward because this is not what I dreamt. This is not what I wanted. This is not, you know, and

and you're moving forward in one step at a time. But that's why community is so important.

That's why accountability is so important. That's why to know that you're not alone. And you know the one word that I hear a lot and you mentioned it earlier too is I felt like a I feel like I failed. I feel like I failed.

How do you reframe that with your client? Because I mean I know what I do to help them understand like to me

you didn't fail. This is life and these are lessons.

Yes. Right. And that's what it is. you know this is like what it's that looking at it from a different perspective you know yes the the relationship ended but that doesn't define who you are that doesn't define your future that you know it it's just it's just part of your story

it's not your entire story

you know there's so much you know that's gonna come from this

and it's like you know and and and but when you're in it when you're in the thick of it. That's all you see.

Yeah.

But as you go through the journey, you're just like, man, like I feel I'm stronger. I'm, you know, more wiser, you know, like it's like so much stuff that, you know, that that you gain from

this experience that you wouldn't have had you not gone through it, you know. But again, um it's it's it's the surrendering, you know, and not trying to do it all by yourself or thinking that you need to.

And that's another thing that you know, it's uh because I think especially with um you know, when you go from having to you being in a marriage and then you're by yourself or a single mother, you start to feel like, okay, you know, I or if you're the person who handled everything.

Mhm.

You know, you start to feel like how am I going to um you know, you feel like it's just something that you have to do. Like I I have a hard time asking for help. I have a hard time reaching out cuz I don't want to appear weak,

right? You know, you're embarrassed. I mean, I hear the word I'm so embarrassed. That's one thing I hear a lot is I feel embarrassed.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. You know, but that's the thing, you know, it's like it's a part of life. It happens, you know, and and the thing is, and what I've learned is by me being honest, it allowed other people to be honest. It allowed other people to be authentic the moment I started being honest, you know, where people were like, you know what, I I I I went through that.

I understand that, you know, but it took me being authentic about what I went through. So, you know, I would encourage someone not to hide,

you know, your story. You know,

do not ignore it. Do not because it's going to come out eventually anyway. [clears throat] You're I'm serious. Like, people ignore these things and then then they wonder why everything's falling apart and and it's like no, like the like I said, it's a signal.

It's it's it's trying to figure out your journey here and your identity. To me, this is what I love because no matter what, if it's if it's a divorce or someone that just found out through ancestry that uh their dad after 54 years is not their biological father,

right?

You see what I mean? That's grief, too. That's identity. You're still alive, you know? So, grief is not just when someone goes to the other side. Grief is a lot of different things. And just

the vocabulary that you give

and also the emotional wheel. Jesus went through every emotion. And if you really study the word of God and see right, he did. He went through all the emotions

and yes,

he gave and God gave us these emotions.

Yes.

It's okay to experience them all.

Right. Right. And I'm so glad that you mentioned emotions because um [clears throat] sorry when I think about anger

which is something that like I said it took me a while to get through um because of the anger that I experienced and some of my anger not just was for my ex and myself. It was also with God when I before

and a lot of people are afraid to be honest about that.

And I'm like, okay, anyone you have a real relationship with,

you're gonna have different emotions with like my relationship with God is real.

So, yes, sometimes I'm angry with him

and he gets it and he wants me to be honest cuz he already knows I'm angry, right? you know, so it's okay, you know, and um and I and I explain that to to to people as well because it's just like Yeah. There are times where I had adult tantrums where I would just be like really upset and then afterwards God would allow me to go through my adult tantrum.

Yes.

And then it's just like, "All right, okay. So, you ready for this lesson? All right. Let's move forward."

So true. I'm still having adult tantrums and I'm 54, girl. No, I'm I'm telling you it's still happening like you know you know and it's okay and it's like he you know he is our father so it's just like and after we've calmed down

just like any parent it's like okay all right so let's move forward because God is not reactive he's not going to go based off of because there's purpose behind our pain like there are things that he wants us you know to learn from this you know so um

yeah so I wanted to you know for those people who are like can I really be angry? Yeah. Like yeah

he's he's sifting all of us like we and refining us like gold

and and it's just you know like it's sometimes life really really really sucks.

I don't know. Yeah.

And and it's about really taking ownership of yourself because that's that's where you have to understand you can't change anybody. You can't change that ex. You can't change what happened in the past. And and what happens is if you dwell too much, and I don't want to ignore the because there's some people are like, "Well, no, that happened.

Let's move on." And I'm like,

"Okay, we need to learn what h because if you haven't learned the lesson, it's going to keep happening until you do."

That's right.

Right. So, so if someone's listening right now and [clears throat] they're like crying in silence and they're overwhelmed and the fear about the future, what would you want her to remember about healing hope and rebuilding her life after divorce?

Mhm. I would want her to somebody who was crying is, you know, to be okay about how you're feeling be cuz the thing is, you know, the the tears are part of the process. And I would say let it flow.

Yeah.

You know, you're human. Let it flow.

Be strong when you can process and go through it instead of ignoring it.

Absolutely. [clears throat] Because if you don't, it builds and it turns into something else and it comes out another way cuz it's going to come out,

you know. So, let it flow, you know, and it and and the cuz part of the the grieving process, there's the grief grief and restorative stage. So, you're going to and it oscillates between the two. So the there's going to be the tears.

There's going to be, you know, um, you know, the the sadness and all of that, but there are going to be moments in between where it's going to you're going to feel like a sense of peace. There mo uh moments where you're going to, you know, find joy.

You know, there are moments. So, it's not straight like the grief all the way through, right?

And over time, it it does get better. Um and and also in those moments, you know, um as you're going through the process, you know, and and and in and later on over time, you'll begin to identify certain things that interest you in terms of your goals, in terms of, you know, um you know, the and seeking, you know, um your purpose as well because um and then and actually doing things that you enjoy because it's not just about the the pain.

It's just like you're going to be like the reinventing yourself, finding yourself again and um you know whether it's hobbies, whether it's learning something new, whether it's you know um maybe maybe you've had a dream of like going back to school or you know doing this training or you know um this career goal, whatever it is, you know, is is just [clears throat] is is establishing those goals and gradually working through it.

Now, in between doing all this stuff, you may have moments. Yeah.

Just like any form of grief where you reflect on these things and it may bring tears and things like that. But

you won't be in a place where you just stuck,

you know. Yeah. And and but again, when the tears come, let it flow. Let it flow. If you have a trusted person that you can reach out to like a close friend, a family member that you feel like that that are safe

and you want to talk through it with them or maybe you want to get a therapist,

you know, or recovery coach. Yeah.

Yeah. Absolutely. So, you know, to talk through it as well, you know, you can do that, too.

Um,

yeah. So it it's there's so much um that can you know come from this experience. So that's what I would encourage you know um the women

now that I know about you I will send them your way because sometimes I send them to divorce care because there is an organization called divorcecare.org I think and and they have a a program as well. But to me,

what I like about your program is, you know, 24

weeks accountability. I think that's the thing because when

you know what is it the the rope of three strands like when one's down like you know this is why we can't do things alone. No matter how much pain just reach out call you know like

find the help you need that it's out there. It's out there. And so I hope that whoever's listening and if they're going through this that you would just, you know, just look at Were there any books or resources that helped you at all besides the word of God of course, but

Yes.

Yes. Um there were there were some um inspirational books that I did um read along the way. Um yeah, there were um yeah, there was a I believe I'm trying to remember the name of the author. Um but I I can provide the resource after afterwards.

But yeah, but there were some books that that I did read along the way cuz

reading is another thing that is very helpful helpful and it could be you know you may not be like an actual like you know you may like audio books that's fine cuz I remember I used to put in some um in my car and just take a drive like as I'm driving um but there were things because that helps also to renew your mind.

Exactly.

You know. Yeah. So, um, but yeah, so those I I do encourage resources, but there were some and I just can't think of one off the top of my head, but yeah.

Well, when you find it to me, that's all good. So, how but you're you're a resource. So, how can someone work with you?

Okay. Yes. So, um I do have um my and I'll and I'll send it. It's on school. That's where they join the community

um the school program. and I have it listed on my Instagram page which is divorce recovery diary. Um that's on Instagram where I share my story and I also share tools as well and um and they'll see the link for the divorce recovery community um in the bio so they can join um they can join it and u yeah so that's pretty much yeah that's the that's the way that they can find me for now.

All right. Thank you, Shirley, for being here. And uh is there anything else you want to say before we say goodbye?

Uh no, that's I I think that's that's pretty much it. I do have an up upcoming workshop that I'm doing, and I don't know when this is going to air, but it's actually tomorrow.

Well, by the time this airs, it'll be uh probably another few months out. Yeah, I record I'm I'm like a Yeah. So, but anytime if is it on your website, too? Like whatever.

It is. It's on the

on the website.

It's on the Instagram page. Yeah, I post it on there. Yeah.

All right. Cool. Because all of it will be in the show notes, all the information on how to get a hold of Shirley and and the information we talked about. So, Shirley, I really appreciate you coming on. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much for having me. And for the listener, please do not forget to trust in the Lord, guard your heart, and renew your mind. Bye

bye bye.

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